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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A south Georgia GIS grunt would be MORE
than welcome at a SHRUG workshop. The Seven Hills Regional User Group is
for people in the South East who would like to attend. SHRUG is certainly
not intended for <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State>
only. If you are in <st1:place w:st="on">Southern Georgia</st1:place> or
anywhere else and would like to attend or participate in SHRUG, you are
certainly welcome.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Janis Paulsen, SHRUG Treasurer<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'> shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us
[mailto:shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Tim Spivey<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 23, 2007 9:56
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">shrug-l@lists.dep.state.fl.us</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> shrug-l: surveying</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Though we in south Georgia use metes &
bounds and the peculiar problems associated with that system, perhaps this web
site will shed some light on how surveyors work in the real world -</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'><a href="http://www.samsog.org">www.samsog.org</a></span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>There have been some lively GIS/surveyor
discussions on their message board, which have helped me immeasurably, and
we have some small dialog between the GIS and surveyor worlds.</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>And a question - would a south Georgia GIS
grunt be welcome at SHRUG conferences?</span></font><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Tim Spivey</span></font><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on"><font size=2
color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:blue'>Tift</span></font></st1:PlaceName><font size=2 color=blue
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType> <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">GA</st1:PlaceName></span></font></st1:place><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'> shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us
[mailto:shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Sykes, John<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 23, 2007 9:32
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Wolfe, Heather; <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Mayo, Michele L.</st1:PersonName>; shrug-L@lists.dep.state.fl.us<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: shrug-l: Heads Up</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;color:blue'>Within the past year, I have attended the ESRI San Diego
conference, the SERUG conference and, of course, the last two SHRUG
conferences. Of the three, the SHRUG meeting has consistently been the
best. I think the mix of <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State>;
State, County and Local ArcGIS users creates the best environment for the
exchange of useful information.</span></font><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;color:blue'>Don't get me started on surveyors, I've gone through four
companies before getting the workproduct I needed on one site alone (50 - 160+ ft
errors should not occur in a sealed survey). You've probably seen my
latest postings here about a survey problem, but I have to balance that with
"map-accuracy", widely used GIS layers that I know are off by 50 -
100 ft or more as well. Part of the problem is that neither
"map-accuracy" nor 1 part in 10,000 "survey accuracy" are
acceptable in today's precision GIS environment (1 part in 1,000,000 is
more like it!).</span></font><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;color:blue'>Anyway, my recommendation is not to mess with the SHRUG
conference, it is one of the best around and the price is right. It will
likely be the only meeting I will get to attend this fiscal year because of the
State's travel & conference cut-backs.</span></font><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><b><font size=6 face="Brush Script MT"><span style='font-size:24.0pt;
font-family:"Brush Script MT";font-weight:bold'><!-- Converted from text/rtf format -->--
John</span></font></b> <o:p></o:p></p>
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12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'> shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us
[mailto:shrug-l-bounces@lists.dep.state.fl.us] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Wolfe, Heather<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, July 23, 2007 8:55
AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Mayo,
Michele L.</st1:PersonName>; shrug-L@lists.dep.state.fl.us<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: shrug-l: Heads Up</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>I'm not in the Seven Hills area, but
wanted to submit a thought to the rest of you. I have always thought
that one of the major sources of disagreement between surveyors and
GIS professionals is that they did not understand each other's roles. My
personal opinion (I am sure some of you feel differently) is that if I can
trust a surveyor to collect field data for me, if he can do it more accurately
than me, and if it is not prohibitively priced for my organization, let him (or
her) go to it! My job is not threatened by this as the majority of what I
do is analyzing data that has already been collected. I fly a desk, not a
Trimble. Neither does my existence as a GIS professional not under the direct
supervision of a surveyor threaten the surveyor's job. Many times I
have questioned about the validity of putting a GPS in the hands of a
field tech instead of a surveyor simply because it's cheaper. Most of the
non-surveyor GPS work that I have seen in different organizations has been done
that way- by field techs, not by expensive GIS professionals.</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>The second observation is that many GIS
professionals I know don't attend FLURISA because it's "mostly for
surveyors" (quote from another GIS professional I know). Most of us have
to choose which conference to go to. Which should we spend our education
allotment on- SHRUG, SERUG, FLURISA or the San Diego ESRI conference?
Usually both SHRUG and FLURISA lose this contest. This is a shame because
there seems to be a widening breach between GIS professionals
and surveyors, two groups who could cause incredible change to our world
for the better if only we can get along. </span></font><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>In view of that, I think that it would be
very beneficial for the two groups to have a joint conference. More dialogue
usually equals more understanding and eventually cooperation. This seems
like a great opportunity to help along the relationship between our two groups.
Will it make SHRUG bigger? Maybe. Is that bad? Sometimes. But there are many
issues in <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State>
where the participation of more people would be beneficial to all (standardized
shapefiles, to name just one). I think that in this situation the greater
good outweighs the lesser evil. </span></font><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Thanks for listening to my soapbox speech!</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p><font size=3 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'>Heather Wolfe<br>
Sr. GIS Analyst, Planning & Development<br>
Seminole <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType> <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Government</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><br>
1101 E. <st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">First St</st1:address></st1:Street>.<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Sanford</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">FL</st1:State>
<st1:PostalCode w:st="on">32771</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><br>
<br>
Office 407-665-7378<br>
Fax 407-665-7412<br>
HWolfe@seminolecountyfl.gov<br>
www.seminolecountyfl.gov</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Mayo, Michele L.</st1:PersonName>
[mailto:Michele.Mayo@dep.state.fl.us] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, July 20, 2007 5:09
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> shrug-L@lists.dep.state.fl.us<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> shrug-l: Heads Up</span></font><font
size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'>Hello List,<O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'><O:P></O:P>A proposal was introduced in Thursday's SHRUG
quarterly meeting to investigate a merger of our annual conference with that of
FLURISA, known as the Joint Mapping Conference.<O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><ST1:PERSONNAME u1:st="on"><font size=2 color=blue
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'><O:P></O:P>Lee Hartsfield</ST1:PERSONNAME>,
current SHRUG president, announced that he had recently been elected president
of FLURISA. Lee now serves as president for both organizations.
After giving a very general outline of his proposal to discuss combining the
two conferences, Lee asked the small gathering to vote for or against further
discussions with FLURISA, saying that, according to SHRUG by-laws, there were
enough people present to take a vote on the matter. Although several of
us expressed reservations, Lee did take a vote and his motion was carried.<O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'><O:P></O:P>This is not a trivial decision. In my
opinion, any proposal that could fundamentally change the character of our
organization should be put to the SHRUG membership at large before any
negotiations are conducted with outside parties. The grass-roots
character of SHRUG has kept our organization strong, solvent, vibrant and
valuable for eight years. We could lose that if we fail to keep the
membership informed and involved in plotting our future course.<O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'><O:P></O:P>If this proposed action concerns you, please let
your SHRUG officers know. Their contact information can be found here:<O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'><O:P></O:P><a
href="http://www.shrug-gis.info/shrug_business.htm">http://www.shrug-gis.info/shrug_business.htm</a><O:P></O:P></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:blue'><O:P></O:P><O:P></O:P><O:P></O:P>Michele
Mayo</span></font></b></strong><font size=2 color=blue><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>, GISP</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<O:P></O:P>
<p class=MsoNormal><ST1:STATE u1:st="on"><ST1:PLACE u1:st="on"><st1:State
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'>Florida</span></font></st1:place></st1:State></ST1:PLACE></ST1:STATE><font
size=2 color=blue><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'> DEP, Beaches and
Coastal Systems</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<O:P></O:P>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>Coastal Data Acquisition Section</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<O:P></O:P>
<p class=MsoNormal><ST1:STREET u1:st="on"><ST1:ADDRESS u1:st="on"><st1:Street
w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on"><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'>3900 Commonwealth Blvd.</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street></ST1:ADDRESS></ST1:STREET><font
size=2 color=blue><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'> MS 300</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><ST1:PLACE u1:st="on"><ST1:CITY u1:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City
w:st="on"><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:blue'>Tallahassee</span></font></st1:City><font size=2 color=blue><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'></ST1:CITY>, <ST1:STATE u1:st="on"><st1:State
w:st="on">FL</ST1:STATE></st1:State> <ST1:POSTALCODE u1:st="on"><st1:PostalCode
w:st="on">32399-3000</ST1:POSTALCODE></st1:PostalCode></span></font></st1:place></ST1:PLACE><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>850.413.7776</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><a
href="mailto:michele.mayo@dep.state.fl.us"><font size=2><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>michele.mayo@dep.state.fl.us</span></font></a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><a
href="http://www.floridadep.org/beaches/programs/cda.htm"><font size=2><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>www.floridadep.org/beaches/programs/cda.htm</span></font></a><o:p></o:p></span><O:P></O:P></font></p>
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font-family:"Courier New"'><O:P></O:P> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>-****<st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State>
has a very broad Public Records Law. Virtually all written communications to or
from State and Local Officials and employees are public records available to
the public and media upon request. <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Seminole</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceType w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType></st1:place> policy does not
differentiate between personal and business emails. E-mail sent on the County
system will be considered public and will only be withheld from disclosure if
deemed confidential pursuant to State Law.****-<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>-****<st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State>
has a very broad Public Records Law. Virtually all written communications to or
from State and Local Officials and employees are public records available to
the public and media upon request. <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Seminole</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceType w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType></st1:place> policy does not
differentiate between personal and business emails. E-mail sent on the County
system will be considered public and will only be withheld from disclosure if
deemed confidential pursuant to State Law.****-<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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